With ‘Showrunners’, Irish filmmaker Des Doyle talks to the brains who hold the reigns on such shows as ‘Boardwalk Empire’, ‘The Leftovers’, ‘Buffy The Vampire Slayer’ and ‘Star Trek’. Paul Byrne puts him on the couch.
As the little box in the corner has become the little device in your pocket, the computer in your room and the big screen with the surround sound system in your living room, the way we watch TV has changed dramatically in recent years. What hasn’t changed though is the simple equation of flops versus hits.
For self-confessed TV nerd Des Doyle, exploring the machinations behind the multi-billion dollar industry that is the TV series meant talking to some of Hollywood’s biggest makers and director-shakers. Somehow, this first-time director did indeed get to talk to some of the biggest names in the industry, including JJ Abrams (‘Lost’, ‘Felicity’, the ‘Star Trek’ big-screen reboot, the upcoming ‘Star Wars’ big-screen reboot), Joss Whedon (‘Buffy’, ‘Firefly’, ‘Angel’, ‘Cabin In The Woods’, ‘Avengers Assemble’) and Terrence Winter (‘Boardwalk Empire’, ‘Sopranos’, ‘The Wolf Of Wall Street’). It’s a hugely impressive roll-call, and if Doyle’s documentary ‘Showrunners’ is beautifully crafted and will play extremely well on the small screen. Just how small that screen is is up to you.
PAUL BYRNE: Jane Espenson reckoned you were nuts, and you’d never get access - what made you keep going here? A vision? A gut instinct? Having absolutely no other good ideas?
DES DOYLE: “Think it was sheer bloody-minded Irish determination on some level. I genuinely believed if I could actually get to the guys themselves that my passionate interest in their work and world would convince them to sit down with me, and thankfully that proved to be the case - once I did actually manage to get to each of them!”
It was all triggered by a chance meeting with Joss Whedon, outside JJ Abram’s offices. Floodgates open after that, or was it a struggle every time you approached someone new?
“That chance meeting with Joss actually happened quite a ways into making the film after spending a year trying to reach him! The interview we did that really changed people’s perceptions of us over there in the early days was when Damon Lindelof agreed to take part. Damon gave us a brilliant interview that we were able to include in a "sizzle reel" for the film that we just released within industry in LA. From that point on it wasn’t a case of the floodgates opening but it did help to make people take us and the project more seriously. But it was different with everyone; a year to get Joss, 18 months to get JJ!”
Despite the fact that these guys know what people want - or, at least, they hope they do - did you ever encounter any David Brents? Any poor unfortunate with a superiority complex and no self-editing skills?
“No, not really. To ever get a shot at being a showrunner you need to be a very smart, sharp, confident writer/producer. It’s not really about being superior to people but a certain cockiness is an advantage because you need to argue and defend your ideas on a daily basis with the studio or the network, or your cast or the other writers, and they all need to have the confidence in you that you know what you’re doing and where you’re going. The absence of that in a showrunner is a recipe for disaster!”
When Damon Lindelof and Carlton Cuse were on Jimmy Kimmel Live, suddenly, the showrunner was in the spotlight. You recognise immediately that there was a shift occurring..
“'Lost' was really a touchstone show for the ‘rise of the showrunner’. It was a global phenomenon where the two writers were put out front and centre to explain the show because they were the only ones that could. As a result they became as well known and as interesting to the fans as the actors.
“In a smaller way this had happened with Chris Carter on ‘The X Files’ and Joss Whedon on ‘Buffy’ too but it was the power of the Internet and the birth of social media tools like Twitter that really helped catapult Damon and Carlton into another league where now many showrunners exist.”
Lot of headaches and heartbreaks in American TV, with, as pointed out by Showrunners, an 84% failure rate for new shows. Ever get the feeling these guys were a particular breed of animal, ambitious verging on psychotic?
“Every showrunner is different but they all need 2 things to succeed - a ton of self-belief in their ideas and literally superhuman levels of stamina. Producing 22-24 episodes of TV every 9 months is like becoming the CEO of a company of 300 people where you’re given 80 million dollars and told to go off and produce 22 mini-movies with that. That workload is literally insane and it can break and burn people for sure. As for the guys who run multiple shows at the same time - I bow down in wonder at those skills!”
Having said that, the excess-all-areas producer era that could cough up a creature like Don Simpson is perhaps a thing of the past. All the professional plate-spinners on Showrunners seemed remarkably sane for such a high-pressure job.
“It really depends, I think, on how long you’ve been doing it, and how successful you have or haven’t been with the shows you've made. With experience and success can come the calmness - with failure and regret can come the burnout and sometimes the complete opposite of that statement is even truer.”
Looking behind the curtain, did you witness any Larry Sanders-esque moments that just couldn’t be left in the final edit?
“My lawyer says I can’t answer this question [laughs].”
The way people consume their films and TV shows has become so on-demand orientated, storytelling has shifted to reflect that. People want an itch that just keeps on needing to be scratched. Where do you think this shift will end? Will the live broadcast be merely for news, sports and special occasions in the near future...?
“It’s very hard to predict where the ever-changing broadcasting universe is going to end up. Certainly we are living in the world of narrow-casting now where perceived niche programming is thriving on cable. But the networks aren’t giving up on trying to get audiences watching live in big numbers hence the current boom in shows being live-Tweeted - as you watch the episode you can Tweet with the writers, the cast, the showrunner, and have your answers in real time as you watch. That’s pulling in huge live audiences for demo shows such as ‘Pretty Little Liars’, leading to a two-season renewal for that show, which is a very rare thing in TV!”
Where does this self-confessed TV nerd get his kicks right now? What shows, and where, and, of course, how?
“‘Game Of Thrones’, ‘The Walking Dead’, ‘Halt And Catch Fire’ and ‘Fargo’ have all been hugely enjoyable this year. The Blacklist is a guilty pleasure too purely to see James Spader deliver those wonderful laconic speeches! I’m logging a lot of hours on Netflix these days - recently re-watched ‘Twin Peaks’, one of the all-time great shows, and I’m very curious to see what the new 2015 mini-series from Lynch and Frost will be like.”
Where to next, dear boy?
“I have a new doc in early development, also about a creative enterprise. We just attached first talent and will be shooting some stuff with them in LA soon. A lot of people have been asking me about Showrunners 2 also, but let’s see what happens with this one first!”
